GT6Steve Posted December 18, 2013 Share Posted December 18, 2013 I LOVE Speedi Sleeves and have saved a lot of old machinery (including Triumphs) with them. And I'll make a note of that number for future reference. One of the silly assed things I did for the racer was to make an aluminum front crank seal surface with a speedy sleeve to replace that Oh So heavy stock piece. Yah, I'm an anorak but the sleeves were free so why not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lincspeed Posted December 18, 2013 Share Posted December 18, 2013 Not being an engine builder, but what is a speedy seal and how do they work? Clark if it ain't broke, modify it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2.5piman Posted December 18, 2013 Share Posted December 18, 2013 Hello Clark, Speedy sleeves are a sleeve of very thin steel, sized to fit snugly onto a damaged shaft such that the seal now has a nice smooth surface to run on. As lip seals are flexible they will accomodate the slight increase in shaft diameter. Normally used to cure seal leakage due to a groove being worn during service. Alec Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted December 18, 2013 Author Share Posted December 18, 2013 just hope they don't become a stress raiser Chunkiest bit of the crank - I'm sure it would break elsewhere first. Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted December 27, 2013 Author Share Posted December 27, 2013 Put the cam in today - then did something I've never done before and looked down the follower bores to see where the lobes were relative the centres. The results were surprising (to me) New cam (Newman supplied) showed very marked offset from the centre. Most were "behind" the centre, but some were ahead and one nearly central. Pic 1 shows a typical one, behind the centre line. Pic 2 shows the other way, well ahead of the centre line to the extent that it looks as though it could be off the edge of the follower. Somewhat discouraged I removed it again and stuck an old Triumph PI one in there. This shows the same effect, some ahead of the centre line, more behind, but much less so. Pic 3 shows the same follower bore as pic 2, but with a Triumph cam Pic 4 shows a typical one. Should I be worried? Is this why cams and followers get chewed? Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RealWorld Posted December 27, 2013 Share Posted December 27, 2013 Nick I've observed this in Triumph 4 and 6 pots and most recently a Ford pre-crossflow. Some of the 'tolerances' do seem over enthusiastic - my best guess is they're off centre to encourage the rotation of the follower and therefore reduce wear overall. I may be being blindly optimistic however... R Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted December 27, 2013 Author Share Posted December 27, 2013 They are definitely meant to be offset to promote rotation. It's the variability of the offset that bothers me - especially the one that looks like it will hang clear off the side of the follower...... Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GT6 Nick Posted December 27, 2013 Share Posted December 27, 2013 Is the oil pump's scroll centred? If it's in the right place, then the cam lobes probably are too. Unless it's a reproduction camshaft - if it is, do you have an original to compare the lobe positions? If you have an aluminium front plate, that could be causing problems. The aluminium front plate I bought from Rimmers was thinner than the original steel plate by a millimetre or so. The result was that the camshaft sat further back in the block, and the camshaft sprockets didn't line up. I moved the camshaft retaining plate forward by putting washers of the correct thickness between the alloy plate and the retainer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted December 27, 2013 Author Share Posted December 27, 2013 Pump drive gear looks ok for position. It's an original steel front plate. Cam is a Newman one. Lobe widths are 13 - 13.5mm as compared to 12mm for the OE PI/Mk2 one, which is possibly contributing to the visual effect. OE one also shows offsets, but more consistent. Reading on the net suggests I should probably be more concerned about the ones that don't show much offset........ Also there is something odd about the groove at the front for the thrust plate. On the old cam a new thrust plate gives correct end float and free rotation through 360º. On the new cam it gives free-ish rotation for about 120º (well below book end float though) and is very stiff (barely turn by hand with the sprocket fitted) through 120º with 60º middling stiffness transition zone at either end. A used keeper plate eases the problem, but gives variable end-float dependent on position. I've checked for burrs etc run a fine file around to no effect. Presume the groove is cut at a slight angle. The spigot for centering the sprocket is on the big side too - can only pull it on with the bolts and getting it off is a struggle. Reckon the cam-grinder buys the blanks in pre-machined - quality not 100%. These last two issues are not a big deal really but irritating as it wastes alot of time trying to make it right. Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Posted December 30, 2013 Share Posted December 30, 2013 (edited) I had the same issue with the cam and front plate. Cam was not turning free ove the circle. I was not able to figure out why. When I tightened the cam retaining plate cam was stiff in some positions and when loosening it the cam retaining plate it Turned free. Martin Edited December 30, 2013 by Martin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted December 30, 2013 Author Share Posted December 30, 2013 Hi Martin, What you describe is exactly the same as my problem. I think one of the reasons is that the plate does not clamp down squarely due to both bolts being on the same side. One of the used plates gives evidence for this by having a wear mark only in the centre of the arc of contact. Also, the cam groove must be either of uneven width (though I can't detect this) or not cut quite straight. It could also be that the cam is slightly bent as I also have 0.4mm run-out on the cam sprocket at it's outer edge. Two sprockets measure nearly the same so most likely the cam. The old, OE cam I tried does not have any of these problems. Unfortunately it doesn't have all its lobes either........ Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pomwah Posted December 30, 2013 Share Posted December 30, 2013 Unfortunately it doesn't have all its lobes either........ Mad like a Ferengi? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike.Luis Posted January 1, 2014 Share Posted January 1, 2014 Happy New Year to everybody! I experienced once the same problem when tightening the front plate and installing the cam bush. The cam did not rotate as soon as I tightened the bush. Problem was that I used a bit to much Hylomar gasket sealing compound between the paper gasket and the block/plate. Wellseal sealing compound on the paper gasket does the job much better. Interesting to see that the lobe offsets of newman cams are different compared to OE cams. Newman should be informed about that issue. Would be interesting to know what's newman's position about the problem of their blanks. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted January 1, 2014 Author Share Posted January 1, 2014 That's interesting Mike. You are probably right about the Hylomar - though it was not (or at least much less of) a problem when I tried an OE cam in there. I'll be calling Newman tomorrow. Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GT6MK3 Posted January 1, 2014 Share Posted January 1, 2014 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted January 2, 2014 Author Share Posted January 2, 2014 Ah, That Newman isn't too easy to reach these days.... The other Newman though responded to my mail today very promptly and positively. Cam is good to use - go for it. Brownie points awarded! Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RealWorld Posted January 2, 2014 Share Posted January 2, 2014 Yes - David and his team definitely do good work, and promptly too! R Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted January 19, 2014 Author Share Posted January 19, 2014 Just about the last job left was to fit the sump. However, although I never noticed any oil surge issues I still wanted to fit a baffle to it first. So I referred to several previous discussions on this very forum and concocted my own. I started by filling the sump with the 4.54 litres of water, propping it at the same angle as it sits in the car and marking the liquid surface level. Then some tape measure and CAD (the cereal packet type) led to an MDF former so I could beat a lip all around the horizontal plate. Having got the horizontal plate shaped and fitted to my satisfaction (having made a left hand one first!) I then cut a strip and shaped it to try and hold the oil closer to the pump pick-up. This is firmly tacked to the horizontal baffle and sits about 10mm from the floor of the sump. I strongly suspect it is over-kill. I think the horizontal plate is probably all that is needed unless doing autotests on soft slicks. I even remembered to make a hole for dip stick to pass through! Some pics Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted January 19, 2014 Author Share Posted January 19, 2014 Baffle was tacked into the sump (I'm not intending to be taking it apart too often) and fitted. So now the short engine looks like this Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GT6Steve Posted January 19, 2014 Share Posted January 19, 2014 That looks pretty good Nick, I have no problem with the baffle being tacked in place, You can still clean it enough when required. Are you at all concerned about the copper pipe cracking at the fittings? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted January 19, 2014 Author Share Posted January 19, 2014 Yes, slightly concerned about the copper pipe cracking. I'll make a bracket to give it some support in the centre that'll pick up on one of the engine mount bolts. I could also put some rubber tube over it where it sits close to the block (most of the way along in fact) or even stick it to the block with silicon/Tiger Seal to damp any vibration. Would be better as steel hydraulic tube or even Bundy but have yet to find a source for a reasonable quantity. Not sure I could bend the steel to the relevant shape anyway..... Do you think it's likely to be a problem? Cheers Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GT6Steve Posted January 19, 2014 Share Posted January 19, 2014 I assumed you were going to support it from the engine mount based upon the excursion under the mount. That'll certainly help. I'm just suspicious of copper in vibration prone areas. But then, you guys run copper brake lines all the time without failure? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2.5piman Posted January 20, 2014 Share Posted January 20, 2014 Hello Steve, "I'm just suspicious of copper in vibration prone areas. But then, you guys run copper brake lines all the time without failure?" Yes but there is quite a difference, brake lines are fitted to the body and clipped quite securely, there is far less mass per unit length and to a structure that has little real vibration. Personally in the above instance I would use a flexible oil line, Aeroquip or similar. Alec Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin Posted January 20, 2014 Share Posted January 20, 2014 Is this the primer or the final colour scheme for the engine? Martin p.s. is the LHD version of the horizontal plate suitable for the cars on the continent ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted January 20, 2014 Author Share Posted January 20, 2014 Hah..... the old primer question. Haven't had that one for a while. It is the final colour - same as the car - which also got alot of the "is that still in primer" questions when I first started driving it. The LH version of the plate is really the upside down version of the plate as I formed the edges in the wrong direction so they point up instead of down...... Possibly more useful to those in the Southern hemisphere...... Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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