Engine stand for rebuild?

[John I]

What is the general view of the many minds who make up this font of knowledge on the use/benefit or otherwise of engine stands.

I am soon to strip and slowly (because of all the other things that life engages us with) rebuild my 6 cylinder. Are engines stands worth their money or is it a bench job. What are the pluses and minuses?

Your collective experiences gratefully received, thank you all in advance.

John

[Chippy63]

They do worry me when my heavy stag lump is hanging from one end . I tend to put a strut under it once in the required position. The other thing is they tend to get in the way of the rear crank seal area. Ive often thought it would be better to make a stand that picks up the engine mount bolts with maybe the option of rotating it front over back instead of sideways. All in all though i guess they do the job just could be better.

[JohnD]

Use an old rear engine plate.

Cut the middle hole bigger so you can replavce the rear engine seal housing in situ.

Then it's supported on the seven bolts around the housing, not just four.

Paint it RED so you don't re-use it

DON'T reuse it.

 

PS A Stag engine ain't so massive, 202kgs (446lbs) while a six-cylinder weighs 186kgs (404lbs)  So 16kgs heavier.   Ok, that's a small child!

 

Edited February 25, 2020 by JohnD

[John I]

That won't be allowed next season because it's painted red!

[rogerguzzi]

2 hours ago, Chippy63 said:

They do worry me when my heavy stag lump is hanging from one end . I tend to put a strut under it once in the required position. The other thing is they tend to get in the way of the rear crank seal area. Ive often thought it would be better to make a stand that picks up the engine mount bolts with maybe the option of rotating it front over back instead of sideways. All in all though i guess they do the job just could be better.

Hello Chippy

                     There is a thread showing mounted sideways on a 6 cylinder and did the same with my 4 cylinder then you can get at every thing.

I just used some of the various holes and tapped an unused one and made a plate to suite

Roger

ps I have photo but on a different computer

[ed_h]

This one allows flipping end over end.  Also, both ends are unencumbered.

Ed

[yorkshire_spam]

12 hours ago, John I said:

Are engines stands worth their money or is it a bench job. What are the pluses and minuses?

I wouldn't be without mine for working on an engine out of the car, For me (limited bench space) it makes keeping the job clean and out of the way much much easier.

9 hours ago, rogerguzzi said:

There is a thread showing mounted sideways on a 6 cylinder and did the same with my 4 cylinder then you can get at every thing.

I'm intrigued, I'd love to side mount my 4 cyl on a stand, but haven't figured out a way to do it?! I know James in TDC has an adapter design for side mouonting a slant 4...

Cheers,

Sam

 

 

[John I]

 

"Use an old rear engine plate.

Cut the middle hole bigger so you can replavce the rear engine seal housing in situ.

Then it's supported on the seven bolts around the housing, not just four.

Paint it RED so you don't re-use it

DON'T reuse it.

 

PS A Stag engine ain't so massive, 202kgs (446lbs) while a six-cylinder weighs 186kgs (404lbs)  So 16kgs heavier.   Ok, that's a small child! "

JohnD that's  a great idea, then as many bolts as you can get between back plate and stand? Is that the weight with all the bits on the engine?

ed_h. Nice looking assistant, home made I assume? Does this mean a lot of sitting around on the job as it looks very low! What thickness are the side plates, 3/8 they look quite substantial. 

Thank you both for ideas.

john I

 

 

 

[John I]

9 minutes ago, yorkshire_spam said:

I wouldn't be without mine for working on an engine out of the car, For me (limited bench space) it makes keeping the job clean and out of the way much much easier.

 

 

That looks nice and shiney Sam. Did you weld spigots, nuts or what on to the back plate and I assume they are high tensile bolts hanging the rest together.

Cheers John

[yorkshire_spam]

54 minutes ago, John I said:

That looks nice and shiney Sam. Did you weld spigots, nuts or what on to the back plate and I assume they are high tensile bolts hanging the rest together.

Cheers John

The set-up is a bit over complicated and hard to explain... so:

Black: The "arm" from the engine stand (square section to the right, tube section to the left)
Dark green: 16mm bar, cut to length with m12x1.5 thread in the right end, 5/16 unf in the left.
Dark Grey: M12 high tensile bolt.
Light grey: 5/16 unf stud
Red: Scrap backplate to give support to the actual backplate and cut out to access to the crank seal.
Orange: Actual engine backplate
Light green: Angle iron to provide bracing

The dark green and red parts are welded together.  Bolts holing the 4 arms of the stand onto the stand mounting plate are also m12x1.5 high tensile with high tensile nuts.

 

 

 

[John I]

1 hour ago, yorkshire_spam said:

The set-up is a bit over complicated and hard to explain... so:

Black: The "arm" from the engine stand (square section to the right, tube section to the left)
Dark green: 16mm bar, cut to length with m12x1.5 thread in the right end, 5/16 unf in the left.
Dark Grey: M12 high tensile bolt.
Light grey: 5/16 unf stud
Red: Scrap backplate to give support to the actual backplate and cut out to access to the crank seal.
Orange: Actual engine backplate
Light green: Angle iron to provide bracing

The dark green and red parts are welded together.  Bolts holing the 4 arms of the stand onto the stand mounting plate are also m12x1.5 high tensile with high tensile nuts.

 

 

 

That must ave taken almost as long to draw out as constructing the actual thing. Thanks very much for your explanation, a picture worth at least a thousand words.

think I'll wear my steel toe caps when the 6 lump is hanging.

cheers off to the garage to see what materials I need to relieve my late fathers garage of.

[ed_h]

5 hours ago, John I said:

ed_h. Nice looking assistant, home made I assume? Does this mean a lot of sitting around on the job as it looks very low! What thickness are the side plates, 3/8 they look quite substantial. 

 

Yes, home made.  It's low by design.  It is very stable, and most work is done sitting on a nice comfy padded stool. 

You've got a good eye--side plates are indeed 3/8".

Ed

[richy_rich]

Blimey... I just found some long 5/16" set screws and big washers and bolted my engine to the stand.. I'll try and dig out some photos later but I wasn't too worried about it. 

[richy_rich]

.. sort of thing, just a washer either side of the mount and bolted into the block.  I could only manage to make three of the four available mounting 'legs' fit anywhere useful, but it did the job.

[yorkshire_spam]

3 hours ago, richy_rich said:

Blimey... I just found some long 5/16" set screws and big washers and bolted my engine to the stand.. I'll try and dig out some photos later but I wasn't too worried about it. 

I did something similar, but even simpler until I came to fit the oil seal plate. Before I fitted that I just bolted the engine stand plate directly to the back of the block with 4x5/16" set screws. But I came up with the contrived set-up above when I wanted more room to work around the back of the block.

[Chippy63]

21 hours ago, JohnD said:

Use an old rear engine plate.

Cut the middle hole bigger so you can replavce the rear engine seal housing in situ.

Then it's supported on the seven bolts around the housing, not just four.

Paint it RED so you don't re-use it

DON'T reuse it.

 

PS A Stag engine ain't so massive, 202kgs (446lbs) while a six-cylinder weighs 186kgs (404lbs)  So 16kgs heavier.   Ok, that's a small child!

 

Nice idea John

[richy_rich]

1 hour ago, yorkshire_spam said:

But I came up with the contrived set-up above when I wanted more room to work around the back of the block.

Gotcha!  I just transferred it to the bench for that bit..

[Nick Jones]

Side mount is the only way for the 6.  Works really well and simple to do.

This way on one of the bigger Clarke stands

Which is robust and balanced enough to do mad stuff like this.......

And on a cheapy, lightweight stand which I would NOT attempt to hand a 6 on lengthwise

[mtrehy]

Had big V8's on these. 

 

https://www.sealey.co.uk/product/5637187993/engine-stand-550kg

[Chippy63]

22 hours ago, rogerguzzi said:

Hello Chippy

                     There is a thread showing mounted sideways on a 6 cylinder and did the same with my 4 cylinder then you can get at every thing.

I just used some of the various holes and tapped an unused one and made a plate to suite

Roger

ps I have photo but on a different computer

Thanks Roger, would like to see that

[Chippy63]

20 hours ago, ed_h said:

This one allows flipping end over end.  Also, both ends are unencumbered.

Ed

Hi Ed, thats what i envisage as a good solution. Well done.

Steve

[JohnD]

Ed,

Original design!    How did you arrive at the pivot point?   While I see how you can 'flip' it, it looks as if you would have to strain to lift the CoG above the pivot.   Am I wrong?

JOhn

[Chippy63]

31 minutes ago, JohnD said:

Ed,

Original design!    How did you arrive at the pivot point?   While I see how you can 'flip' it, it looks as if you would have to strain to lift the CoG above the pivot.   Am I wrong?

JOhn

Without having and all round view it does look as though the pivot points could benefit from being lower on the engine which would also mean cross bracing to the frame under the engine could be raised higher for extra strenth.

[Nick Jones]

Not to knock Ed's design, but having used the simple adapter plate idea pictured further up (not mine originally, plagiarism is the sincerest form of flattery!) extensively, on two different engine stands, I can tell you that it works really well with decent balance.  It is also simple and cheap to knock up the adapter plate.

 

[ed_h]

6 hours ago, JohnD said:

Ed,

Original design!    How did you arrive at the pivot point?   While I see how you can 'flip' it, it looks as if you would have to strain to lift the CoG above the pivot.   Am I wrong?

JOhn

Yes, the pivot point is an interesting question.  It depends heavily on what is installed.  The point I chose was based on head and crank in place, but no flywheel.  In that configuration, the engine was very easy to rotate end over end.  Take the head off, and it's bottom heavy, but still rotates without too much effort.  Take the crank out, and it gets better.  There are pins on the pivots to hold the engine in a number of positions.

Ed