Sprint95m Posted January 28, 2021 Share Posted January 28, 2021 https://www.pressandjournal.co.uk/fp/news/aberdeen/2847385/aberdeen-hydrogen-double-decker-buses1/ The trial has proved it to be viable. Not far from me as the crow flies, so to speak, Orkney Islands council are looking at hydrogen powered ferries (as well as motor vehicles). Also on Orkney, a prototype hydrogen powered passenger plane is being developed. Interesting times. Ian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted January 28, 2021 Share Posted January 28, 2021 Bit light on technical detail, but seem to be electric buses with hydrogen fuel cells rather than batteries. Interesting technology. Though hydrogen is rather low energy density and somewhat scary stuff being very inclined to sneak out of small gaps and very easy to light! I appreciate the irony of Aberdeen - UK capital of the oil industry...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebrookster Posted January 28, 2021 Share Posted January 28, 2021 Yeah, Orkney were pretty much forced into it. They produce far more power than they require from wind, and in addition they are also one of the main wave power testing hubs (and some of the test rigs are massive!) However they only have a small interconnector back to the mainland so they were left with the question as to what to do with all the excess. Until last year (I think) residents who owned electric vehicles could charge them for free, and this is partly why they have moved to building hydrogen powered ferries etc. I believe a chunk of Kirkwall is already powered via hydrogen, they started production a while back and needed somewhere to use it. I am following with interest, I discovered this several years ago when I was lassoed into the current relationship, herself's father is heavily involved in one of the wave power projects. Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2.5piman Posted January 30, 2021 Share Posted January 30, 2021 Hello Phil, that is repeated in Scotland itself as they have more wind power capacity than the grid can carry when wind is strong. This means that Scottish wind farms are paid to not generate (At a higher cost than if they were paid for their power). Alec Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sprint95m Posted January 30, 2021 Author Share Posted January 30, 2021 2 hours ago, 2.5piman said: Hello Phil, that is repeated in Scotland itself as they have more wind power capacity than the grid can carry when wind is strong. This means that Scottish wind farms are paid to not generate (At a higher cost than if they were paid for their power). Alec To expand to your comment Alec, if I may.... The links to the national grid are being upgraded (the subsea link from Wick to Blackhillock(near Keith) cost £1.1 billion. The Beatrice Offshore Windfarm creates so much electricity that it has it's own subsea link. BOWL cost £4.5 billion). There is currently work going ahead to connect Shetland to Wick via a subsea cable to permit the export of electricity from Shetland). Scotland has over 90% of the UK's freshwater, hence the huge hydroelectric production. There are projects under way to expand on this. As these come into use, the requirement to switch off wind farms is reduced because the wind generated electricity is used to pump the water back to the hydro schemes' upper reservoirs. Banking. Ian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zetecspit Posted January 31, 2021 Share Posted January 31, 2021 I like the fact technologies are being trialled. Hydrogen has a few issues, as Nick points out it is a true escape artist, but it should be possible to build leak-free systems. And teh energy density is indeed low, something people forget. But teh most troubling one is the inefficiency of the electricity-hydrogen-electricity or indeed heat process. 20% (that is the very best figure, most are worse) is lost by electrolysis. 40-60% efficiency of a fuel cell, or 25% or so with ICE. Those figures are terrible compared to batteries. But then the batteries are another heap of pain. I am hopeful that a good solution can be found. And good to see Mr Biden is taking climate change seriously. Though any good work he does could easily be undone in 4 years time if he pushes the American people too far too fast. But getting the worlds largest economy on track would be great news. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spitfire6 Posted January 31, 2021 Share Posted January 31, 2021 I assume all the Subsea links are two cable DC? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sprint95m Posted January 31, 2021 Author Share Posted January 31, 2021 6 hours ago, spitfire6 said: I assume all the Subsea links are two cable DC? The ones from Wick are DC, yes Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sprint95m Posted May 6, 2022 Author Share Posted May 6, 2022 Been talked about for a while now, at last a date for hydrogen production in Easter Ross…2024 There is a lot happening in the Cromarty Firth as the transition from oil gets under way. Along with parked up oil rigs are the bright yellow offshore wind turbine jackets. Major port expansion and the construction of three factories. Not the far away, at Ardersier the port and fabrication facilities are being repurposed for the renewables industry Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted May 6, 2022 Share Posted May 6, 2022 Bit light on tech detail but interesting and encouraging. The spaceport maybe a bit fanciful? Could probably make my own hydrogen from surplus solar..... but what to do with it...... tricky stuff to store and handle..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebrookster Posted May 6, 2022 Share Posted May 6, 2022 28 minutes ago, Nick Jones said: The spaceport maybe a bit fanciful? Maybe not a fanciful as you suspect? I'm assuming you might not be aware of the push to build one at the north edge of Scotland? https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-48119118 Hydrogen power is already used on Orkney, who due to the low capacity of the links to mainland cannot export a lot of the power that is produced there (many tidal and wave power projects are tested around Sullom Voe, and the power has to go somewhere). So instead they produce hydrogen and take it too Kirkwall and use it there. https://www.orkney.com/life/energy/hydrogen So the technology is there and has been for a while, I'm just slightly surprised it has taken this long to reach mainland Scotland. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted May 7, 2022 Share Posted May 7, 2022 The Orkney hydrogen thing is very interesting….. why is it so little known? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spitfire6 Posted May 7, 2022 Share Posted May 7, 2022 Hi, I am involved in the development a Hydrogen truck as we speak. It is an EV truck that uses the H2 to charge the EV batteries when the truck is not driving. The H2 is used via a module to charge the main cells/batteries. Looks promising. Cheers, Iain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnD Posted May 8, 2022 Share Posted May 8, 2022 The words "Hydrogen" and "Bus" translate in my mind into "Heath Robinson" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnD Posted May 8, 2022 Share Posted May 8, 2022 11 hours ago, spitfire6 said: Hi, I am involved in the development a Hydrogen truck as we speak. It is an EV truck that uses the H2 to charge the EV batteries when the truck is not driving. The H2 is used via a module to charge the main cells/batteries. Looks promising. Cheers, Iain Iain, Why? An EV goes: source of electricity > transport via the grid > storage in the EV > use of electricity to move. Each ">" has some inefficiencies. Your project goes: Source of electricity > H2 generation > H2 storage and transport > H2 storage in EV > Generation of electricity from H2 > use of electricity to move. You would seem to be adding H2 as a transport and storage medium, with its own inefficiencies. And to add the very heavy H2 storage kit to the vehicle. Surely a better way to move heavy freight would be by providing the moving truck with a constant supply from the electricity source? Overhead cables and a pick-up slider, like the old trolley buses, but the cost of fitting those to motorways would be prohibitive! ("Smart" motorways have been bad enough!) What about dedicated way, for them, and rails to guide them so no need to steer? A "rail-way"! Wow, I'm a genius! John 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted May 8, 2022 Share Posted May 8, 2022 Whatever happened to hydrogen fuel cells? Seems like a key component in the hydrogen economy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spitfire6 Posted May 9, 2022 Share Posted May 9, 2022 Hi, My mistake. The truck uses the four H2 cylinders to deliver around 50kW/hr while driving. Battery capacity is around 250kW/hr. Cheers, Iain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted May 9, 2022 Share Posted May 9, 2022 Hydrogen burnt in IC engine or converted to electricity via fuel cell? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spitfire6 Posted May 9, 2022 Share Posted May 9, 2022 HI, converted to electricity via fuel cell. Cheers, Iain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterC Posted May 9, 2022 Share Posted May 9, 2022 What happened to making H2 from methane bubbled through molten tin, with the liberated carbon floating to the top ( and used as soil improver etc) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sprint95m Posted May 9, 2022 Author Share Posted May 9, 2022 (edited) It was reported last Friday that the hydrogen powered buses serving Aberdeen city have reached one million miles of use Ian Edited May 9, 2022 by Sprint95m spelling Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sprint95m Posted May 9, 2022 Author Share Posted May 9, 2022 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteStupps Posted May 9, 2022 Share Posted May 9, 2022 Hydroliner makes it sound like a boat! Good news story but there's something amiss with the numbers on the side of the bus isn't there?? According to Google it's 40k miles around the globe, so 1 million miles would be 25 times around. And 100 million miles sounds like too many for 15 buses around Aberdeen in a year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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