fuel tank prep for EFI

[James]

So I have this lovely tank I bought 3 years ago - eBay 99p bargain.

 

Now ideally I should take the chance to mod this so that it works beautifully with EFI.

 

In tank fuel pump? But I don't really understand how they mount!

 

A Freelander pump was mentioned before I think - but not quite sure how that actually fits in? It would need some sort of mounting ring?

 

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/FREELANDER-PETROP-PUMP-UNIT_W0QQitemZ280481133073QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM?hash=item414dfa7211

 

[JohnD]

You'll need  an extra, return pipe, as EFI passes fuel past the injectors under pressure an returns the unused back to the tank.

 

An in-tank pump needs careful positioning, as fuel injection is unforgiving about sucking air into the system, unlike carbs.

Really needs a scavenging chamber, to keep a sub-tank of fuel around the pump.

 

John

[SteveA]

Take a look at spitfire6's photobucket album, there are a few pictures in there of a in-tank injection pump being fitted.

http://s743.photobucket.com/albums/xx79/spitfire2500/?start=20

 

 

 

I picked up a in-tank pump with views of fitting it to my GT6 tank a while ago. This one has a type of swirl pot in the bottom of the tank, where the returning fuel is used to produce a venturi effect to keep the swirl pot full.

 

 

 

underside of swirl pot showing the (green pipe) returning fuel

[James]

Hmmmm an in tank pump seems like a air amount of work - more so when I have space in the back of the saloon (for PI under the boards)

 

I may go for a large CAV filter in the standard PI location with a pump under the boot boards then.

 

The only mods needed for tank are return pipe and enlarge the outlet to allow a bit more flow.

[SpitmkIIICPH]

James I have a MII PI with tank, that I am moving from Storage in a couple of weeks.

 

I could snap some pictures of the in and outlets on the orriginal PI tank if needed (the pump and gear are sadly long gone :-()

[James]

It's ok - I have some diagrams and I'll be making it up as I go along anyway.

 

So making a shopping list

 

swirl pot:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/FSE-FUEL-SWIRL-POT-PETROL-FUEL-SWIRL-POT-10mm-12mm-6mm_W0QQitemZ280423103256QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM?hash=item414a84fb18

 

fuel pump and bracket:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/SYTEC-IN-LINE-HIGH-PRESSURE-FUEL-INJECTION-PUMP-250BHP_W0QQitemZ400110536649QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM?hash=item5d287247c9

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/SYTEC-ALLOY-FUEL-PUMP-FILTER-BRACKET-BLUE_W0QQitemZ200441345588QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM?hash=item2eab3c3634

 

As for filtration - that swirl pot has a filter - so I just need one after the pump. I think.

[toofast2race]

Save your cash

 

Bosch pump will fit into an old ignition coil bracket. Just mount to body using two rubber bobbins  http://www.antivibrationmethodsrubber.co.uk/html/bobbin_mount.html

 

If you drill out (slightly) the inlets and outlets to a Lucas CAV set up and fit bigger unions,  it flows enough for a Bosch. Just need to fit a bigger outlet to the tank (drill that out a bit a bit too)

 

It is effectively a Swirl pot too.. I actually use the drain outlet on the CAV as the fuel supply

 

My only mod needed is to fit a thicker wall hose (or nylon?) on the feed side of the pump as its a bit squishy when warm

[DaveNotSoSideways]

A job I'll be on soon when I fit my GT6 Tank and mod that ready for FI.

 

Be something like Andy, external pump off some production car.

 

Mod the tank for return lines and sort breathing.

 

Gonna be feeding a tall slim round tank with a flat alloy base, bolted to the bootfloor, like my header tank, around 2litres with my existing FACET from normal tank outlet

 

I will feed the high pressure fuel pump from this 2litre swirl tank.

 

Facet will pump fuel into swirl tank/antisurge tank at max rate on -6 and there will be a smaller -4 return line in the top that goes back to the fuel tank.

 

If designed right I can have it so it can run without the Facet pump going, so if that failed its no biggy to get home.

 

Thats what I am doing cause it keeps everything accessable, easily worked on etc, it's bolt in without any major surgery needed.

 

 

 

 

[James]

Ok that looks like a good solution! And some savings too!

 

Do these look about right?

 

10mm inlet should be.

 

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/CAV-Diesel-Fuel-Filter-Glass-Water-Trap-marine-boat_W0QQitemZ370245866550QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_CarsParts_Vehicles_BoatEquipment_Accessories_SM?hash=item56345f9436#ht_2028wt_851

 

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Lucas-CAV-Fuel-filter-water-seperator-with-metal-bowl_W0QQitemZ160417198850QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_CarsParts_Vehicles_BoatEquipment_Accessories_SM?hash=item25599c3302#ht_890wt_851

[James]

Bargain: http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/CAV-FUEL-FILTER-PART-NUMBER-5836B080_W0QQitemZ360241754175QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Cars_Parts_Vehicles_Other_Commercial_Vehicles_ET?hash=item53e014f03f#ht_500wt_1091

 

[JohnD]

The point of a SWIRL-pot is that the fuel is pumped in at a tangent, to induce a SWIRL inside the pot.  This circular flow pushes any air bubbles to the centre, where there should be a vent that takes them and any fuel in excess to the current pump requirement, back to the tank.

 

I can't see how that eBay item, which is a filter housing, or the Lucas filter holder, can be so described.

 

I've posted pictures of my boot setup so many times, I won't bore you again, but it is now bullet, or air-bubble, proof.

 

John

[James]

Well if Andy's works then it works.

 

I've driven a PI'ed Spitfire with nothing more than a large fuel filter before a modern pump and it only really had issues when the tank was less than 1/4 full and cornering very hard.

 

James

[Nick Jones]

Mine simply has an old, well used pump out of an old Peugeot mounted under the boot floor (Vitesse tank is mounted lower) and fed from the tank drain point.  No swirl pot or even a filter (naughty  : and it works fine right down to well into the red on the fuel gauge without any surge induced misfire.  Once into the red the pump can be heard getting all excited as the dregs slosh away from the tank outlet, but still no misfire.  No doubt the Vitesse tank shape and position is better able to resist surge than the 2000 or spit but even so I'd think you'd be fine using a decent filter housing.  Certainly helps to have a nice large line to the filter and pump and put a tap in it to ease any maintenance that might be needed.

 

Nick

[GT6 Mike]

Just for info

 

The in tank pump fitted to Spitfire6's contains the swirl pot and fuel pressure regulator, it only needs one fuel line to the engine.

 

Pump originally fitted to the KV6 engined Freelander.

 

[James]

Interesting.

 

So no return? And the end of the fuel rail is blanked off?

 

I am guessing it has a hose to reach the bottom of the tank? Or is that upside down?

 

**EDIT** ignore me - it's not upside down

[GT6 Mike]

James

 

It's basically a 2 part spring loaded canister that sits on the bottom of the tank, it contains the filter, pressure regulator and venturi similar to that shown in your picture.

 

My own car has a fuel return using the same pump but with a couple of modifications. We decided to build Iain's with no return for comparison, I also think its a neater job (no external regulator or fuel return required).

 

Worked fine during mapping on the rolling road.

 

Only went with an in-tank pump due to lack of space.

[James]

I do have a fair bit more space! So perhaps external will be simpler - certainly simpler for maintenance should I need to take it out etc

[Nick Jones]

I do have a fair bit more space! So perhaps external will be simpler - certainly simpler for maintenance should I need to take it out etc

 

This is the view I would take!

 

Nick

[esxefi]

could be a problem with not having a return line of the possibility of fuel boiling in the rail in extreme temps in traffic,mine did last year in the very hot spell in june,but mine cycles through a seperate swirl pot so was picking up more heat each time the fuel went round the system.