Nick Jones Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 Commenting here as I can't comment there..... any longer. We've recently had a minor influx of folks from the TR Register Forum. This is very welcome, and we are very happy to see you, but I can't help but wonder whether it might be partly driven by the odd (in my opinion) decision by the Register to remove the "At the Bar" (ATB) section and the accompanying edict that "all non-technical discussion outside the Members Area" will be removed. I suspect this might be an own-goal and will make that forum a poorer place. I think it sends the wrong message and risks causing people to drift away - possibly to the dreaded Face-ache. Pity as it's got some excellent technical contributors. I have noted that a few threads on there have been somewhat inflammatory and some contributions rather intemperate (to say the least), leading me to wonder on more than one occasion whether a dementia assessment, or at least a medication adjustment might be needed. Others were merely a bit "pithy" or robust banter between people who know each other well. Some of them I really couldn't be bothered to read. If I want to read the rantings of the hanging/flogging/Brexit brigade then I can always buy a Daily Mail/Sun/Telegraph. However, due to the moderator policy of just "disappearing" threads I sometimes missed the action and I was never quite sure where the boundaries were. So I do accept that it was an occasional problem area. However, the "cure" is a bit extreme and I suspect won't solve the problem, just hide it from non-members like myself. - If you find a thread irritating/offensive then you don't have to read it. - I have noticed some finding offence where I could see none. If you are that easily offended, stay away. Or do they secretly enjoy it? - Almost none of the "offensive" ones I've seen have had direct personal attack in. This would be always be clearly unacceptable. - The sometimes seemingly arbitrary removal of whole (sometimes quite long and mostly positive) threads offends some and doesn't help anyone judge where the boundaries are. Also gives a rather unpleasant "big brother" feel. - Most, if not all of the worst offenders are Register members (possibly why they have not been disciplined?), so can potentially carry on in the members area. Won't solve the issue of offended members leaving the club. Though if that easily offended.......? - Some of those campaigning for the removal of the ATB section seemed to be the same ones causing the problem. Eh? WTF? If I were a conspiracy theorist (depends how well my medication is working), I'd almost think they were doing it on purpose to force the closure, though I can't imagine the motivation. - I've not seen any action taken against these offenders (and there are only a few) beyond the wholesale deletion of a thread (which causes offence to some as censorship in its own right). Surely much better to operate a warning system and to just remove / edit the offensive post or lock the thread? - There were some truly worthy and heartwarming threads on there too - especially those offering support to people suffering serious illness. Gone. Or at least invisible to non-members. I am sad about that. So, wrong way to tackle the issue IMO, but if it brings more people here, there is at least a silver lining....... Nick PS. This is in NO WAY intended as an invitation to take potshots at the TR-Register! Grudges elsewhere please! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rogerguzzi Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 (edited) Hello All I am just an old man from Barcelona(as manuel would say) so I know nothing! But I thought these clubs/Forums were just old car club/Forums? But a lot of rattles have been thrown out of prams! I vote for Governments to do that for me! Roger ps I have been a member of the TR Register since 1970(probably before half of you were born?) and I don,t think I have upset anyone on purpose! Disagreed yes. Grudges destroy families(the wife used to work for a solicitor in wills and probate and the tales you would not believe) so an old car club may not have much chance? How about this engine? V8 500cc makes our Triumphs look a bit crude and built in 1955! Edited January 5, 2018 by rogerguzzi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterC Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 1 hour ago, Nick Jones said: Commenting here as I can't comment there..... any longer. We've recently had a minor influx of folks from the TR Register Forum. This is very welcome, and we are very happy to see you, but I can't help but wonder whether it might be partly driven by the odd (in my opinion) decision by the Register to remove the "At the Bar" (ATB) section and the accompanying edict that "all non-technical discussion outside the Members Area" will be removed. I suspect this might be an own-goal and will make that forum a poorer place. I think it sends the wrong message and risks causing people to drift away - possibly to the dreaded Face-ache. Pity as it's got some excellent technical contributors. I have noted that a few threads on there have been somewhat inflammatory and some contributions rather intemperate (to say the least), leading me to wonder on more than one occasion whether a dementia assessment, or at least a medication adjustment might be needed. Others were merely a bit "pithy" or robust banter between people who know each other well. Some of them I really couldn't be bothered to read. If I want to read the rantings of the hanging/flogging/Brexit brigade then I can always buy a Daily Mail/Sun/Telegraph. However, due to the moderator policy of just "disappearing" threads I sometimes missed the action and I was never quite sure where the boundaries were. So I do accept that it was an occasional problem area. However, the "cure" is a bit extreme and I suspect won't solve the problem, just hide it from non-members like myself. - If you find a thread irritating/offensive then you don't have to read it. - I have noticed some finding offence where I could see none. If you are that easily offended, stay away. Or do they secretly enjoy it? - Almost none of the "offensive" ones I've seen have had direct personal attack in. This would be always be clearly unacceptable. - The sometimes seemingly arbitrary removal of whole (sometimes quite long and mostly positive) threads offends some and doesn't help anyone judge where the boundaries are. Also gives a rather unpleasant "big brother" feel. - Most, if not all of the worst offenders are Register members (possibly why they have not been disciplined?), so can potentially carry on in the members area. Won't solve the issue of offended members leaving the club. Though if that easily offended.......? - Some of those campaigning for the removal of the ATB section seemed to be the same ones causing the problem. Eh? WTF? If I were a conspiracy theorist (depends how well my medication is working), I'd almost think they were doing it on purpose to force the closure, though I can't imagine the motivation. - I've not seen any action taken against these offenders (and there are only a few) beyond the wholesale deletion of a thread (which causes offence to some as censorship in its own right). Surely much better to operate a warning system and to just remove / edit the offensive post or lock the thread? - There were some truly worthy and heartwarming threads on there too - especially those offering support to people suffering serious illness. Gone. Or at least invisible to non-members. I am sad about that. So, wrong way to tackle the issue IMO, but if it brings more people here, there is at least a silver lining....... Nick PS. This is in NO WAY intended as an invitation to take potshots at the TR-Register! Grudges elsewhere please! Nick, You're on the ball with your analysis. If you could read the Members' Chat you'd see your points made. There is a suspicion that the powers-that-be do are focussed upon the potential adverse image the forum might give to potential new members. Indeed when one member calls another a 'f8kcwit' the image takes a dint. But rather than excommunicate that member the entire AtB was shut down and all the threads lost. Many of us recognise friends who post on both ST and TRR fora. Long may that continue, but with ST providing an outlet for the humour, non-car topics, and support that AtB provided. Peter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnD Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 The post that broke the camel's back - although Chairman Hogan denies that, and says it has been long-planned - was personal, foulmouthed invective. As a mod, I'd have blanked it at once, and the poster. Who has a long history of similar conduct, but came in under a Non d'Internet,which is difficult to avoid without time consuming vetting processes. I used to frequent some US sites, whose subject is as benign as is classic cars. But they required a ferocious moderating regime, else firefights broke out. It had a stringent language code as well, and I finally gave up after being banned, for saying that something was "b^llshxt". I should have, and would again, follow Colonel Potter in MASH and referred to buffalo bagels! Does Sideways need to take action? Not since GT's pronouncements were put into their own forum have I seen anything here that was more than a difference of opinion. All very adult! But should we discuss options,just in case? I think that a deleted post should appear as such, not just disappear. A scale of bans for perpetrators should apply, from a few days to life (vetting problem acknowledged) and it discussion of sanctions should be banned from the board. Appeal to the moderators should be possible, but only by PM. John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chippieman Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 I too, am investigating where a serious cencorship elswhere be remidid by some banter here, not a new member though, signed uo quite awahils ago, though might be a bit more active now, so how are photos included here? John. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PGB BME Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 Hi I too have come from the dark side of the TRR following the removal of the ATB by the powers that be. Owning several TR's some running some at restoration stage I have decided to part company with the TRR after 10yrs a member. Hopefully I can get the technical and banter from this forum. I think the attitude of the Chairman and Directors towards the TRR membership is totally out of order. Regards Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PGB BME Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 John Nice to see a friendly face look forward to the banter as well as the technical assistance Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TR5tar Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 Hi Nick, Your take on what has been happening over at the other place is well observed. Recent changes over there means that it no longer delivers what I'm looking for from a forum, namely a fun, friendly element, to go along with the technical stuff. I also want a forum where people are not overly sensitive and easily offended. A bit of banter is good, and the odd disagreement healthy in my opinion. But, as you say, personal attacks are not on. Since joining Sideways yesterday, I've taken the time to have a good look around what is on offer here and I have to say it looks very good. I like the layout, design and ease of posting photos. It's a credit to those that built and maintain it. It's great to see other familiar names and faces here. I just hope you don't mind us all coming to live with you Cheers, Darren Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted January 5, 2018 Author Share Posted January 5, 2018 It's good to have some new faces. It's been a bit quiet here for a while. This seems to be a fairly general trend in the Triumph Forums, (probably car forums in general) with even Club Triumph being much slower than it used to be. I'm told there is more traffic on the Facebook groups, but Facebook has never much appealed to me. Craig has done a great job with the platform - all credit for that is his. Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TR5tar Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 2 minutes ago, Nick Jones said: This seems to be a fairly general trend in the Triumph Forums, (probably car forums in general) with even Club Triumph being much slower than it used to be. I'm told there is more traffic on the Facebook groups, but Facebook has never much appealed to me. Nick I'm not a FarceBook fan either Nick. I only joined a year or so ago in order to set up a group page for my local Register group. FB always strikes me to be more about saying "I've got this ... or I've done this", rather than a place to have a discussion. Forums like this are far better. Cheers, Darren Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted January 5, 2018 Author Share Posted January 5, 2018 Yes, plus the forum maintains a record so info is findable again (usually!) with a search. I occasionally go looking for info and find myself back at a post I wrote 10 years ago..... must be going senile! Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rogerguzzi Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 Hello All old and New It is getting busy on this site. I am looking forward to hearing of modifications and exploits on and in the cars and out of the cars!!!!!!!!!!!!! Roger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave M Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 Another migrant from the TRR forum joining Sideways Over the years I've enjoyed topics ranging from antipodean avian visitors to watches ( couldn't ind any XYZ examples) & some dubious jokes but it appears these are no longer tolerated. I really can't see how any meaningful discussion can be carried out via Farcebook or Twatter so looking forward to rejoining some discussions on here DaveM Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldtuckunder Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 Nice to see a few new here, but familiar faces from TRansylvania dropping in for a Pint after the introduction of prohibition there. Just slightly worried you may find the conversations here a tad lacking in the cut and thrust of AtB. For a Forum that I think would tolerate a lot, it has always surprised me the level of self censorship that virtually everybody shows, however as Forum's go this one has an incredibly high level of technical to noise content, so close to 100% of topics tend to be On Topic, although there is a good smattering of self deprecating humour! Interesting that I always felt comfortable dropping into AtB to have a good poke at Brexiteer's, whilst it would never have occurred to me to do so here. Welcome! Alan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterC Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 Alan, You mean there's no remainers to joust with on here...oh dear. And I read all that Stiglitz stuff just to preach to the converted ? Peter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted January 5, 2018 Author Share Posted January 5, 2018 44 minutes ago, oldtuckunder said: Nice to see a few new here, but familiar faces from TRansylvania dropping in for a Pint after the introduction of prohibition there. Just slightly worried you may find the conversations here a tad lacking in the cut and thrust of AtB. For a Forum that I think would tolerate a lot, it has always surprised me the level of self censorship that virtually everybody shows, however as Forum's go this one has an incredibly high level of technical to noise content, so close to 100% of topics tend to be On Topic, although there is a good smattering of self deprecating humour! Interesting that I always felt comfortable dropping into AtB to have a good poke at Brexiteer's, whilst it would never have occurred to me to do so here. Welcome! Alan There's always the Ranting Zone (perhaps TRR should have one - skull and crossbones at the door - enter at own risk and don't bother if sensitive!). Seems to be mostly me ranting about wire-chewing squirrels, plumbers and insurance companies though..... I'm not sure there are that many Brexiteers to poke at on here..... I think I had my big rant about that on the CT Forum. Was tempted on the TRR, but could see that getting out of hand due to the substantial presence of the never-wrong brigade. I'm going to post some dirty pictures in another thread now in something approximating technical content. Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alec Pringle Posted January 5, 2018 Share Posted January 5, 2018 It's a great shame that the TR Register board of directors have behaved with, as I see it, such crass incompetence and over-reaction in terms of responding to small problems and evolving the TRR Forum . . . . . but they have, and it will detract from the TRR's long and proud history of being more than just a car club. Nick's analysis is near enough the mark, on most counts, and no doubt the TRR Forum changes will benefit Sideways . . . . Hopefully we can resume some of the interesting topics which disappeared from the TRR Forum amidst the Stasi purges of this past few days ? Cheers, Alec Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TR5tar Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 3 hours ago, oldtuckunder said: Nice to see a few new here, but familiar faces from TRansylvania dropping in for a Pint after the introduction of prohibition there. Just slightly worried you may find the conversations here a tad lacking in the cut and thrust of AtB. For a Forum that I think would tolerate a lot, it has always surprised me the level of self censorship that virtually everybody shows, however as Forum's go this one has an incredibly high level of technical to noise content, so close to 100% of topics tend to be On Topic, although there is a good smattering of self deprecating humour! Interesting that I always felt comfortable dropping into AtB to have a good poke at Brexiteer's, whilst it would never have occurred to me to do so here. Welcome! Alan Hello Alan, Nice to see you over here. I'll try not to mention the "B" word around, given our lengthy past discussions on it Perhaps Nick should stick us bunch in the Ranting Arena and let us get on with out Cheers, Darren Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chippieman Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 Hi All, so for a very inexperienced comp non-buff, how do es one include photos in a post on here guys - please? John. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnD Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 Click in the "Reply" box. It expands to provide space for several lines. Bottom left hand corner, "Drag files here to attach, or choose files..." Click on that, and your disc explorer will open. Select a picture from there by clicking on the picture. Click on "Open" Voila! John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Kirk Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 Hi, Everyone I have also joined from the TRR forum after 15 years. John it is really easy on here to add a photo just choose at the bottom of the reply choose files click on what you want to import and click choose Cheers Phil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chippieman Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 ThThought be might be fun to start a 'Whats going on in your Garage' thread. This is mine today. Started with some bubbles on the top of the rear wing, but am pleased with the work I did 15 years ago on the tub, all still solid! John. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamish Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 John have all you Northern lads got those impressive green garage car lifts !! picked up the gearbox crane from Jim today. Looks a great bit of kit. Just need to fix the leaking gearbox before using the crane to refit it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chippieman Posted January 6, 2018 Share Posted January 6, 2018 Not all of us Hamish, but as you can see it does get a lot of use. My record is 4 different TR's in the day, before our annual group Jaunt up the West Coast of Scotland. Concrete v knees only one winner at my time of life, feel free if you want a natter about the crane. John. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrianC Posted January 31, 2018 Share Posted January 31, 2018 I posted this on another TR refugee's introduction thread but perhaps it's more relevant here: I think we are going to see a lot more TRR members on here soon. I have stuck with the TR Forum whilst we were pointing out the gross errors in managing it but the latest Board intransigence and overzealous and nannying moderating is beyond a joke. It's not just about removal of 'At the Bar' and wanting somewhere to discuss non-motoring topics with TR friends (including non-TRR members). Most of the TRR members dipping a toe in the Sideways water are amongst the main contributors to the TR technical posts so perhaps if enough move over here and cease participation in the TR Forum, the technical value of the TR Forum will wither and the Board will scrap the entire Forum, fulfilling the long declared wish of the majority of 'Directors'. I really don't want that to happen, but there is no evidence that the Board is going to take notice of the wishes of 200 members. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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