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Hello. New here. Was told maybe some of you could help with an issue I'm having with my car.

First. I need to tell you that the frame was cut at the back just in front of the diff mounts. Blocked and a straight axle was installed. Not well executed either.

So I took all that out.. found a 70/71 spitfire and cut the frame out with all the suspension bits still on the frame. Then stripped and then mounted and fish plated on the the gt6 frame. Then all new brakes, lines, fuel lines, new bushings and shocks.  ( spit was done, rotten ) 

The new set up would be a swing spring. Which works nice. I had it on the road for 2 months. Drove it. Was good. Centered and tracking nice. No tire wear etc...

So here is the issue... the car leans to the right passenger side. The right rear tire has more camber in wards then the left.

I jacked up frt and back. When frt up the rear still leans. Back up the frt sits up with the other side. So the issue is in the rear.

Left sits properly and camber is proper. Wheel is sitting straight.

The right sits lower the tire chambers in ward more. Any help would be appreciated for sure...

thanks for the add to the group..

Cheers.

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I wonder how level the diff is mounted?

That is responsible for the rear spring, so a very small tilt will have a much larger effect at the end of the spring. 

It may be worth removing the rear spring, and putting a length of steel across to check measurements.

Likewise I have heard of bent diff front arms causing similar issues.

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1 hour ago, RedRooster said:

Wrong halfshaft?

Has got to be a suspect.  RH with short shaft. LH with long.  Are you aware that there are two different shaft lengths with 1" difference - which isn't especially obvious if you don't know about it?  You remark about the tyre sitting more inward is suggestive.

Roll stiffness at the rear is very low.  Other possibilities. 

Spring / spring mount box.
Stiff trunnion on the RH

 

Diff front mount plates are often (always?) bent but normally in the plane which just makes fitting them difficult.

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Oh. Ok. Ya I had no idea one side is longer. I will need to check this out. 

Measure them and see. So the right side would be short side?

Diff seemed to go in ok. I'll need to get it on a hoist. Pull it apart. See what's what.

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Guys thanks for the list of things to check. I will need to measure some stuff. if the shafts are indeed different. 1 inch is a fair amount. It would push bottom cause the camber to tilt inward. Makes sense. 

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Longer shaft would also make the car sit lower that side. 

The radius arms "should" be different between short and long shafts, though in practice if a wrong shaft has been fitted owners manage to fit the existing radius arm....Checking shaft should be easy enough with a tape measure.

My concern about diff mounting is that if the chassis has been cut off and then replaced it is quite possible there is a small mis-alignment, which becomes significant once the spring is fitted.

Other problem is that the chassis are flexible enough to make measurements tricky. Not sure how to overcome that, I have a slight lean that I have not got to the bottom of. Yet.

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8 hours ago, 1superman said:

Oh. Ok. Ya I had no idea one side is longer. I will need to check this out. 

Measure them and see. So the right side would be short side?

Diff seemed to go in ok. I'll need to get it on a hoist. Pull it apart. See what's what.

One side 'might' be longer on your car.  It's not supposed to be, but you might have a mismatch of parts.

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Yes, to clarify, the shafts should be the same length, but the fact the two sizes exist and look very similar means that they do get mixed in error.  If you do find you have mis-matched shafts and have to choose which to match, long shafts are the latest version and are reckoned to give the most benign handling.  However the short shafts allow fitting of wider wheels/more offset - and wide/more offset wheels give a similar effect to the long shafts.

As Clive says, the radius arms vary with shaft length and need to match - also common to find mismatched.

57 minutes ago, zetecspit said:

My concern about diff mounting is that if the chassis has been cut off and then replaced it is quite possible there is a small mis-alignment, which becomes significant once the spring is fitted.

Not so much on a swing spring car.  The OE chassis are not that accurate anyway......

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Ok. 

The rear suspension came out of a car that was original. All the parts that came in the frame I used came off the same car. So I'm sure that there would be no mix matched parts. The wheels ends I thought about last night. You cant mix them up the shock and control arm mounting in only on one side. So if backwards they would be upside down. Which would never fit and you would know right away. I never had the axle shafts out of the hubs. Just replaced u-joints and bushings. So they would have been installed the same side as on the original car. 

Still though. Let's say the body is off the car, taking the body out of the equation. Just a frame assy.. the wheel would be still leaning inwards at the top more. 

Where the car was welded and fish plated was ahead of the diff mounts. 

So the piece welded in, had the diff mounts attached to it. 

The frame was internal plated. Example, the frame is a box frame. There are 2 1/4 inch x about 5 or 6 inches long that were put into the inner box part of the frame first. With the frame mounted to the body by the 2 bolts in the trunk. 

Those were welded in. 2 on each side. Then fish plated around the out side with 1/4 inch plates on both sides. It's very over kill really. But it will be stronger then the rest of the frame. :)

the car tracks good. Dosent seem to have alignment issues. Tires were fine. its centered in the wheel arches. Etc..

just has this lean and camber issue on one side. The other side sits perfectly no issues. Good amount of suspension bounce, then the right has very little its stiff. 

pic 1 is left side. Perfect. 

pic 2 is right. Leaning. 

 

 

 

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Try undoing the shocks.

I had a spit years ago, bought to "improve" after a minor accident.

The shock on the rear LH side had a weird issue. It was just about solid and lifting the car in that corner, felt like a really strong spring (my weight barely moved it) and no idea what was going on. A swap of shock solved the issue.

 

Just a thought.....

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Hmm. Ok I will try this. Easy to do. 

They are new oem style shocks. 

Possibly one is sticking.. 

Also wonder about the trunion, if it would stick out ward to cause the lean of the tire inwards at the top. ?? 

I'm new to the triumph cars. Basic cars but not really. Lol..

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5 hours ago, Nick Jones said:

Yes, to clarify, the shafts should be the same length, but the fact the two sizes exist and look very similar means that they do get mixed in error.  If you do find you have mis-matched shafts and have to choose which to match, long shafts are the latest version and are reckoned to give the most benign handling.  However the short shafts allow fitting of wider wheels/more offset - and wide/more offset wheels give a similar effect to the long shafts.

As Clive says, the radius arms vary with shaft length and need to match - also common to find mismatched.

Not so much on a swing spring car.  The OE chassis are not that accurate anyway......

Ya. The shafts and control arms are the same length. I remember putting the control arms side by side. Same.

I put new shocks on they were abit hard to get in with bushings. Maybe... one is sticking?? Possibly? 

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On LHD cars, at least US models, there is a spacer in the left front shock tower to compensate for the weight of the gas tank and the driver on the same side. Just make sure such spacer is not on the opposite side. 

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Just looked at your pics, the left side is higher so this would not be the case... 

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5 hours ago, 1superman said:

Good amount of suspension bounce, then the right has very little its stiff

Think this is key to your problem.  Either the damper has a problem or the trunnion swivel is very stiff, this prevents the spring from returning the car to the natural ride height on that side.

As your donor Spit is 70/71 the shafts would be the short ones if original.  But never underestimate the ability of the PO to mess things up!

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Ya I'm thinking it is. Possibly a shock or a trunion.. I'll pull it apart and check. Will pull the shocks off the bottom as well see if it changes. 

I'm positive they are the long shafts.

Equal lengths,  longer. Spring is shorter then the original gt6 spring I have. 

It's the better swing spring assy.

I was told a 71 or 70 but it maybe not the case. The car was all original,  was in a british scrap yard shop. For yrs sitting rotting away. Only good thing was the rear suspension, diff and frame.

Frt end was toast!! Frame and all. 

I'm positive it's all original and untouched. The guy knows his stuff and he had it along time back in the back.

Here some pics of the back through the rims. Only thing I see is the left side has some gapping in the leafs right side has none. It's not the main problem but an issue. 

First pic is right side..

Second pic left side. Ok..

Third pic left side spring. Ok. Has some gapping

Fourth is right no gap. 

5 leaf swing spring setup. 

Thanks again guys. . Great help!! 

Cheers

 

 

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Hey Guys, I see you are looking after Dylan quite well, I knew he would get the required perspective from the group.

I wanted to share a few of my initial concerns when he and I were discussing this problem. The donor car is an early 5 leaf spring, and a Spitfire not a GT6. The receiving GT6 is an ex Rotoflex car, so he can't use the GT6 spring that came with it. The GT6 swing spring is a different stiffness as well as differing eye to eye length and also has 6 leafs. Couple the fact that the old Spit spring will have knackered spacers or non at all between the leafs and is unlikely capable of bearing the extra weight, as well as all of the probable circumstances brought up previously by other observers here, I think there are a lot of contributing factors to be examined.

My main concern, and I have proffered this to Dylan, is having a very washy/rolly rear end and a relatively small sway bar up front left over from the  pre existing rotoflex  configuration on the GT6. Not that it explains the current body or chassis tilt, but could be a contributing factor.

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Too rusty by far, my OCD couldn't cope with that at all.

Try slacking off all the suspensions bolts and see where she sits.

RR

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The Spit spring is certainly on the soft side for a GT6 but the car doesn’t seem to be sitting all that low, even on the low side. Maybe the big wheels are throwing me off.

Ive seen it reported that cleaning and greasing the spring leaves a replacing the mashed or missing rubber buttons with nylon or pyre can help a lot.

Inclined to agree re the front ARB. Should be the thicker one to match the swing spring.  Might be a question of taste though..... sharper turn-in vs less roll. Could try some higher rate front springs too. I’m liking the 330lbs ones on mine. That’s Rotoflex though with the skinny ARB

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17 hours ago, TIMSGT6 X 5 said:

Hey Guys, I see you are looking after Dylan quite well, I knew he would get the required perspective from the group.

I wanted to share a few of my initial concerns when he and I were discussing this problem. The donor car is an early 5 leaf spring, and a Spitfire not a GT6. The receiving GT6 is an ex Rotoflex car, so he can't use the GT6 spring that came with it. The GT6 swing spring is a different stiffness as well as differing eye to eye length and also has 6 leafs. Couple the fact that the old Spit spring will have knackered spacers or non at all between the leafs and is unlikely capable of bearing the extra weight, as well as all of the probable circumstances brought up previously by other observers here, I think there are a lot of contributing factors to be examined.

My main concern, and I have proffered this to Dylan, is having a very washy/rolly rear end and a relatively small sway bar up front left over from the  pre existing rotoflex  configuration on the GT6. Not that it explains the current body or chassis tilt, but could be a contributing factor.

Thanks tim.. it's been very helpful.

Seems like a good group. Helping rather then bashing like other forums. 

Thanks for the info on the forum.. 

Cheers.

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Hope not telling you how to suck eggs, but, how about undoing all the suspension joints one corner of the rear car and then by putting a trolley jack under the vertical link and supporting the weight of the car (on that corner), tighten up the fasteners to the correct torque settings. And then do likewise on the other side.

I would also think about changing the nylocs for new ones.

Also, get the car four wheel aligned once this problem has been sorted out. You may need some shims for the front radius arm joint, between the rad.arm bracket and the heel board.

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Thanks..

Ya. I just took the wheels off, checked the movement of the trunions. They pivot/move when the wheel end is pushed down and pulled up.

I unbolted the shock on the right. put the wheel back on still leans. the spring moves well. I'm starting to think the spring is worn. 

Yes I need to replace all the nylon nuts. I just got this all together at the middle of fall beginning of winter drove it for about a month or two. so now its winter and just working on it now again. I know theres some stuff to get to. But for now it will work. Just need to get this lean figured. yes it will need a 4 wheel allingmnet, also will need shims on the frt. For sure I know this. One side is shimmed other isnt. 

I am rebuilding the front end before it's time to get it out for summer. The rear is all new. Just need control arm bushings new trunions. ( mine are fine for now ) will get replaced. 

I think the spring will come out and I think I'll get a helper spring with new bumber/nylon sleeves. 

I think the spring its self is weak. It's hard to believe for me that it would be with the wheel camber going it. but I think it is. One side sits perfectly. Lots of suspension travel. Other side has very little and is about 1 to 1.5 inches lower. 

If I could get a new or a good used swing spring I would. Not sure I will find one. So getting this one sorted will have to do. It will go on the hiost once the good weather gets back. 

This lean is buging me now. Lol... this needs to get sorted real soon!!! Lol

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You can simply swap the spring around, see if the lean moves to teh other side. That would confirm spring one way or another.

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May be worth looking at the front end.    Is your antiroll bar distorted?

Take it off and lay it on a flat surface.   Will it lie flat?  A twisted ARB will cause a 'set' on the rest of the car, that could account for your apparanet rear imbalance.

John

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