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Portable Generator fault


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HI all

I used My Wolf generator the other day to power a mig welder to try and spot weld a couple of parts on the Vitesse. I,ve owned the generator for about five years and only used it a couple of times.The car is in a lock- up with no available power. Tested that the generator could power the Mig at home and all worked well. Set up at the lock-up, proceeded to weld and I think the torch stuck to the panel for a split second, and the generator stopped producing power.

Checked the circuit breaker which had not tripped. YouTubed and googled the fault, and tried the regenerating of the windings with a drill trick, suggested but still not producing power, so may have burnt something out inside

Not sure if there is a capacitor or AVR inside, I could only find a small black rectangular box behind the a cover on the end of the generator, looked good, not melted or mishapend, but thought capacitors where cylindrical. 

Called a repair shop who said they don't repair that brand.

Thoughts are now do I scrap it and buy a power inverter off ebay, enough to power a drill or grinder, or take a chance and try and source parts for the generator, by process of illimination.

Any suggestions ideas.

Like the idea of an inverter (quieter for the locals) 

Mark

 

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Cheap electrical goods can be very frustrating!

I have a "Little Devil II" propane heater.   It's predecessor, the same brand, failed (out of warranty, of course!) and the very helpful Machine Mart helpdesk diagnosed a failed thermocouple.  They supplied a new one, but it wasn't the same item, proved difficult to fit and didn't revive the heater.    I've risked a new one, as there's nothing in the same therms/pound range and B/  I have a thumping great propane canister, so an electric one would waste that.     Fingers crossed!

Sorry!  No idea about your generator!

John

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Hello Mark

                   What is the power rating of the generator? and what power rating was you trying to use on the MIG welder?

We have a 3.5Kw inverter on 24volt  1100 amp/hr batteries and my MIG makes the lights flicker a bit and the cooling fans run on the inverter

I think you may be using a much to small a generator(I assume you can pick it up and it runs at 3000 rpm?) perhaps 1Kva?

So only about 5 amps on a good day(that's English amps not Chinse!)

Sad to say but most likely melted the windings!

Roger

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Hi all, thanks for the replies

It's a wolf wp 3500 6.5 hp on wheels from memory max output 3200w (was). Thought i was pushing my luck, but was more concerned about damaging the welder, thinking the circuit breaker on the generator would trip if it was overloaded.

I tried it out and did a few spot welds at home, all seemed ok. I didn't risk running a continuous bead. It's an inverter type Mig, apparently much more efficient than my old Sip, which weighed a ton. 

I think if the welder hadn't stuck i would have got away with it.

On first examination the windings, wiring and connectors all look unscathed and new with no signs of melting,  but I know that doesn't mean much as the damage could be hidden.

Mark

 

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Hi all

After a little research it seemed possible that the Automatic voltage regulator could have blown. I managed to find a new similar one with the same rating 250v 220nu on eBay which arrived today.

The generator now produces power, runs a drill and small compressor as before the fault, but will no longer produce enough power to run the angle grinder it ran peviously. The volt meter on the machine indicates a shade under 220 volts, I can't recall what the power output indicated before the fault.

I may have damaged the windings,  but thought if there was a short  it would produce either 110 volts or nothing as it has outputs for 110 and 240 volts.

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Capacitors do indeed appear to be magic and filled with witchcraft which sometimes leaks away, and unlike the smoke that powers ordinary electrics, witchcraft is invisible so you don’t realise anything is amiss until.......

......... your shower pump randomly won’t start when you go for the final rinse and then having gone dripping down the hall you find the pump is just sat there buzzing and starting to smell a little too warm.....

Off and on at the wall and off it goes again but becomes increasingly unreliable and a fire worry as although it pulls enough current to cremate itself, it’s not enough to blow the 3A fuse or trip the earth leakage device.

Anyway, new cap and all seems good again. Not as cheap as it should have been but much cheaper than a whole new pump!

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12 hours ago, Nick Jones said:

......... your shower pump randomly won’t start when you go for the final rinse and then having gone dripping down the hall you find the pump is just sat there buzzing and starting to smell a little too warm.....

Off and on at the wall and off it goes again but becomes increasingly unreliable and a fire worry as although it pulls enough current to cremate itself, it’s not enough to blow the 3A fuse or trip the earth leakage device.

Ha ha I’m sure we have all done something like this it’s when the ordinary self preservation takes a back seat and you mix a wet body with electrics to rinse the shampoo.  

(They alway wait until you or your significant other has added shampoo)

Edited by Hamish
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A simple tip if you need a new capacitor.

For most industrial applications where size is not an issue AND if you have no clue as to what size cap to get.  Use the external dimensions of the cap.

Go to RSComps on the website and see what they have in that size range. They often state what it could be used for.

I did this with a Halfords Jet Washer. The cap was cleaned of all identification but RS came up trumps.

 

Roger

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  • 2 weeks later...

Hi all

After replacing the AVR on the generator and finding it would not power my angle grinder as it previously had, I started to research other possible causes for the lack of power output. I couldn't find a capacitor and assume the AVR does a similar job. It was now producing approx 220v and would power a small compressor and a variable speed drill, but max speed was noticeably slower than from a mains supply. I knew the initial fault  had to have been caused by a blown AVR, as the generator produced no power until this was replaced. I started to read an Artical on Automatic Voltage Regulators which said that most can be adjusted for power output. 

I removed the AVR and on the back is a tiny brass screw. I started the generator to confirm output according to the machines volt meter which was about 220v. Turned it off and turned the screw a couple of turns clockwise, restarted the generator and the output read about 230V. Still wouldn't run the angle grinder but I could hear a slight buzz so continued the process, the grinder started to work but would stop so continued raising the output until the grinder works all the time. Tried a drill, and that worked fine. 

One concern is that,  when I checked the machines volt meter it now reads about 280v. Not sure how accurate it is,  but I don't  want to damage any power tools especially the lighter duty ones.

So apart from that one concern it all seems to be working as before, for now anyway.

Whats your thoughts on the apparent reading of 280v on the machine and is it likely to damage anything?

thanks

Mark 

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Tested the out put from the generator with a multimeter at the plug socket and it matched the 280 volt reading on the machine. Pretty easy to remove the AVR, and give the screw on the back a couple of turns anti-clockwise and reduced the output to 250 volt. For some reason it won't  run the angle grinder set at this output. Must be the draw on initial startup as it will run everything it previously did. The angle grinder will run off the mains, so a bit of a mystery to me. Could up the output again. I have a vague recollection  that the needle on the volt meter read to the maximum output which is 300 volt  prior to the AVR failing, but really never paid it any attention.

Ordered another spare AVR whilst I have a source as they are cheap and seems to be the thing that goes on these type of generators.

Mark

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  • 4 months later...

I finally got around to investigating this.  It was, of course, the capacitor.  I deduced this by finding nothing else obviously wrong so  I contacted the manufacturer (Clarke) and asked them if they could supply a new capacitor for my particular make/model (there's no part number on the capacitor itself).

They replied with a pdf of the manual (which I already had) and asked me to identify the part I wanted.  As there is only one capacitor in the thing and I'd already asked for it, I gave up on them and got one of the same rating from ebay.  It's not the same size/shape or anything but there's plenty of space inside the generator to mount it securely somewhere.   I fired it up and all systems normal.  I just need to adjust the output (down) a bit as it seems very high, perhaps previous owner had been winding it up as it got gradually worse?

Anyway, cost me a tenner for the cap and the generator was given to me for free as a non-runner.  It didn't run because the fuel cutoff wasn't working, took about 5 minutes to fix.  So, for a tenner and about an hour of my time so far I'm quite happy :)

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