Scooter Posted January 11, 2019 Share Posted January 11, 2019 18 hours ago, Chris W said: Perhaps I should have used the to indicate a joke. Actually I think the 12 stars did signify the number of countries in the EU, pre enlargement. I'm not sure why you think I voted Leave but regardless, I can think of many reasons why I would want to drive in other European Countries. France: Le Mans, Angouleme, my house & to get anywhere else. Belgium: My Great Uncle's grave (Ypres), Spa. Germany: Nurburgring, my company's HQ in Munich and so on........... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R5gRL_mW9nk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulAA Posted January 11, 2019 Author Share Posted January 11, 2019 10 hours ago, JohnD said: No Classic Le Mans this year, next in 2020. The CSCC will be going to Spa again in 2019, and there were 13 Triumphs in the races there in '18. Angouleme? Solitude Revival? John John Will you be competing at Spa? Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnD Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 Can't say at present - want to but there are other things going on in my life. J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 3 hours ago, JohnD said: Can't say at present - want to but there are other things going on in my life. J. Got to get the pump fixed...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richy_rich Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 I definitely will be there Jon, planning to be there competing with the car but definitely there either way Hopefully see you there! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 Utter, total fantasy denial mode re-engaged in Westminster...….. It seems that the little children have to be allowed to pull the pan of boiling water off the stove to learn that it'll be a bad thing...…….. Unfortunately I think it will mostly land on the heads of others Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RogerH Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 They have taken incompetence to a new order For the first two years of the last two and half years they rambled along discussing rubbish. Has the Irish/UK border only just come to light. Surely it was important when the Good Friday agreement was set up and that was more than two and half years ago. It appears to have come as a shock to our honourable members in the commons. If we stay are leave we will be looked upon as a bunch of losers that couldn't argue their way out of a paper bag. Roger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnD Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 (edited) This is all due to the same group of Tory MPs, that is today the "European Research Group" and in John Major's day were "The Bastards". They had enough influence to expel Mrs. Thatcher, probably the most popular (if also divisive) PM ever, and bouyed with self-imprtance in JM's time, tried to derail his attempts to produce a deal with Europe, at Maastrict. Now, their refusal to consider any opinion not their own has wrecked al negotiations with their own party and Prime Minister or with Europe. Their blind - nay, wilful, for they are not stupid - failure to recognise the need for Ireland to avoid a hard border so as to preserve the Good Friday Agreement is disgraceful. Any responsible government will have plans for the use of the military to support the Civil Law, but that they have got those plans out, dusted them down and reviewed the deployment of troops says to me, bring it on! Civil disobedience is only a stones throw away, to remove these coxscombs. JOhn Edited January 30, 2019 by JohnD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 The “Bastards” are all very rich men with very rich friends and they have an agenda. That is to crash out of Europe as hard as possible (preferably making it look like EU intransigence is to blame) and to create as much mayhem as possible. In their nasty little minds ( and quite likely in reality) this will enable all kinds of drastic economic and (de-)regulatory measures that would never get through otherwise. Relaxation of environmental laws, employment laws and the like. This to benefit them and their friends. Damage done to companies not their own, especially foreign owned is all to the good as it softens up the competition and will allow them to raise prices. Damage done to the UK and it’s people is a matter of complete indifference to them. Their true vision for this little island is not a place I want to live in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRooster Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 Did that years ago, worked in enough countries to know a shit one when i am in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2.5piman Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 Hello Rod, the thing to remember si that the E.U. has never been a democratic institution, it is a supranational one and run by selected officers. Alec Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 Alec, the EU is behaving very much better than our own “government “ who still at this late stage, put their own and party interests before the country. As for democracy, nearly two thirds of the electorate did not vote to leave the EU. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulAA Posted January 30, 2019 Author Share Posted January 30, 2019 6 minutes ago, 2.5piman said: Hello Rod, the thing to remember si that the E.U. has never been a democratic institution, it is a supranational one and run by selected officers. Alec Alec Forgive my bluntness, but there are seventeen pages of comments on this thread, quite a few of which contain factual references and explanations of the structure of the EU and the UK's relationship with it. But in all the chaos caused by the UK's shambolic govt, you find an occasion to blame the EU. The EU has maintained a steadfast and clear position, the united opinion of 27 diverse and at times disparate nations. The UK is one nation which can't even decide what its opinion is. Looking from across the water, I was, I regret, amused this morning that the Murdoch and Barclay Bros press managed to conjour a single, lone victory for Mrs May out of her disastrous tenure at No.10. Believe me that the world looks on in disbelief and ever greater sorrow at our once-great nation. Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zetecspit Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 42 minutes ago, Nick Jones said: As for democracy, nearly two thirds of the electorate did not vote to leave the EU. And for balance, a few more did not vote to remain! Which sums all this up really. there can be no compromise. The EU and UK want very different things if we leave. And sorry, but I do think the EU is being "difficult". Especially as this whole debacle could have been avoided if they had the sense to take David Cameron a bit more seriously when he went with the dilemma 3(?) years ago. Just saying No is not helpful, and it could be suggested therefore the EU's lack of understanding is why leave got more votes than remain. Or maybe not lack of understanding, but inflexibility and wanting to control how things happen, in a control-freak way. Which never ends well. This country has had its divisions clearly expressed. However, I would stake my pension that many other european countries are the same, and are no doubt watching how we progress. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldtuckunder Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 3 hours ago, RogerH said: Has the Irish/UK border only just come to light. Hi Roger Makes me very sad to say so, but if you care to go back to the Brexit Thread at the TRR started some 2.5 years ago you will find that this and all the other "little" difficulties that seem to have surprised people were all predicted, as was the stance of the EU to which the generic Brexit response was don't be stupid it will be sorted by Christmas "they want to sell us Proseco and BMW's". I will admit that we didn't predict how completely incompetent our government would be in handling the process (but who the hell could) but the problems, difficulties were all obvious before the vote, nothing that has come to pass should surprise anyone. And remember they haven't even started negotiating the future deal yet, if you think they couls spend two+ years just sorting out how to leave, how long do you think it will take to do that? Ok don't tell me it will be sorted by Christmas. Alan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 3 minutes ago, zetecspit said: And for balance, a few more did not vote to remain! No, that's wrong. Registered electorate of 46.5m 17.4m (37.4%) voted leave 16.1m (34.6%) voted remain the balance (28%) did not vote. Therefore 62.6 did not vote to leave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RogerH Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 Hi Alan, if things had been done properly 2.5 years ago things may be different now. BUT the Irish border will still be there. As you say - all sorted by Christmas (but necessarily this coming one) Roger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rod1883 Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 ...and 62.7% didn't vote to Remain. But that is all in the past. What is criminal/incompetent is the lack of statesman like leadership exhibited by our politicians in coming together to create and drive for a vision of our place in the world post Brexit - a situation where we should be looking to trade with all countries and uphold great standards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnD Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 Gosh, Zetec, "The EU and UK want very different things" The problem is that the Tory party want very different things. JOhn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 33 minutes ago, Rod1883 said: What is criminal/incompetent is the lack of statesman like leadership exhibited by our politicians in coming together to create and drive for a vision of our place in the world Can't argue with that. We are in for a rough ride in or out with the current shower in Westminster - and I don't restrict my remarks to Tories. Nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterC Posted January 30, 2019 Share Posted January 30, 2019 The problem the EU faces, if it does not renegotiate, is a no-deal Brexit and a border in Ireland. The very same very reason for it not renegotiaitng the backstop. Brussels is now in a damned if you do, damned if you dont situation. As long as May threatens a no-deal she has leverage over EU. Peter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toronto Tim Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 I've lived across the water for almost 20 years, so step into these things with great trepidation. However, if those in the House that voted for "alternative arrangements" truly believe that they are 100% viable, then the backstop shouldn't be any sort of a problem, because it will never be needed. Seems pretty simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GT6MK3 Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 5 hours ago, PeterC said: The problem the EU faces, if it does not renegotiate, is a no-deal Brexit and a border in Ireland. The very same very reason for it not renegotiaitng the backstop. Brussels is now in a damned if you do, damned if you dont situation. As long as May threatens a no-deal she has leverage over EU. Peter Party One "We've decided to break out of our longstanding agreement, and will negotiate in good faith to do so" Party Two "No worries. Lets do a deal" Deal agreed to. Party One "We now want to change the deal" Part Two "No. Pay up" Supporters of Party One's decision to break the agreement "We now have leverage" Rest of the world "Bwahahahahahahahahahahaha." GB economy "Gurgle" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zetecspit Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 10 hours ago, Nick Jones said: No, that's wrong. Registered electorate of 46.5m 17.4m (37.4%) voted leave 16.1m (34.6%) voted remain the balance (28%) did not vote. Therefore 62.6 did not vote to leave. A misunderstanding of the word balance? What I meant is (using your numbers) is 65.4% did not vote to remain... (more people did not want to remain than leave) Or rather, the people who did not vote don't count. More fool them. I voted remain, but respect the vote. And that many who voted leave did so for very good reasons, and like so many things I may not agree with some of those reasons, but I have full respect for most. Likewise I think there were many who voted remain for crap reasons. Looking back both campaigns were rubbish and full of BS. And mostly emotional rather than factual. If remain had put a proper campaign together then we would not be in this situation. And that was down to ALL parties. Look at the labour electorate, many of the working class areas voted strongly to leave. So blame them? It seems that the "middle class" socialists in this country were remain, the "working classes" leave, and the the tories were quite split. So all this is not down to political leanings but emotions and what the electorate thought was important for them. And I object to people who voted to leave being portrayed as either idiots, stupid or greedy. I simply don't think that is true in that majority of cases, and it has been a big contributor to this nasty split in society that is developing. The remain camp need to stop sticking their fingers in their ears pretending they cannot hear the leavers, and listen to the reasons (plus the opposite, but it seems the remainers are more inclined to this approach. Corbin has been useless, with absolutely nothing positive to contribute, swerving it all using stock phrases ). Only then will we, as a country, be able to move forward. And hopefully this dreadful split start to heal. As to the idea of a so called peoples vote, what happens if that comes out as leave? what next? Or do we really upset everybody by parliament simply deciding to stop the leave process. Whatever the law is about referendums, it happened and the public had their say. Our servants (mp's) need to be damn brave to overrule that. Which is one of the key reasons the original vote went the way it did: people peed off with politicians having an elitist agenda and ignoring the electorate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zetecspit Posted January 31, 2019 Share Posted January 31, 2019 9 hours ago, JohnD said: Gosh, Zetec, "The EU and UK want very different things" The problem is that the Tory party want very different things. JOhn John, see my above post. On the ground look at the sheer numbers of working class, labour voters who want to leave. And at the same time look at the number of tories who wish to remain. Mr Corbin is not exactly a remainer. I think "undecided" is the best description for him. Just so happens the Tories are in Government. What is the Labour policy? (apart from a few soundbites) Have they got a magic wand? I don't think so. If I was TM, I think I would have handed Corbin the job of negotiating the deal. However, I have my doubts he would accept. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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