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  2. EFI issue. K3.

    Hi, I will use Nicks AFR's and let it tune. I have 32 points and therefore much higher resolution than Nicks, should help the tune better? 200 RPM sites at my end should make self tuning easier.. Fitted the gauge/controller tonight and at lunch-time Friday, paid a garage a tenner to swap the lambda's. With no sensor fitted the gauge shows 14.8 AFR. Sensor fitted and hanging in free air shows +20 AFR.. Surprised no sensor connector gauge showed 14.7.. Never checked the output to ECU, but hope this was 20+ AFR? Cheers, Iain.
  3. Today
  4. EFI issue. K3.

    Hi, The K3 has provision for Open-Loop, Closed-loop & Adaptive. I will set 0 to 1K RPM at 0 load site for closed loop @ 13.7 & everywhere else as adaptive. 15 AFR at zero load and 12.5 @ WOT interpolated between. Hopefully a few hours driving will populate the "correct" fuelling numbers in the cells. Ignition timing is another matter! ****************** Just received an update on this thread. Will post this first! ************ Cheers, Iain.
  5. Not yet, Steve! Still have to develop the testing rig! As my cousins will say, "Softly, softly, catchee Great Ape" John
  6. The Real Triumph Rocker Ratio

    What becomes even more interesting is when you start plotting the valve lift against actual crankshaft degrees. Plotting the results of different cams against each other would be really interesting........ Nick
  7. EFI issue. K3.

    15.2 will be too lean for a 2 valve Triumph engine - especially a 2.5 with more limited squish. You'll likely need to be richer than 14.7:1 to get a decent idle. More like 13 - 13.5 typically - but experiment - it wants whatever it wants. elsewhere, this is the target table I use. The 600/900 rpm areas are too lean but I only allow it to tune from 1200 rpm upwards anyway.
  8. Survey on crank damper pullies

    Good report John, very clear and concise! have you started ‘testing’ my slipped damper yet? steve
  9. Link to website of new motorsport club for those interested in competing in 'club' racing www.cmmotorsportclub.com Pete Richards
  10. The Real Triumph Rocker Ratio

    Only because I would like to know, but are we sure the driven end length doesn't change? although it is roughly curved, does that curve actually compensate, or over compensate for the tip moving in towards the pedestals as the rocker rotates, anyone care to measure? Alan
  11. Right, link to here inserted on the Technical Articles thread. Looking forward to some criticism please! John
  12. The Real Triumph Rocker Ratio

    The rocker ratio is the ratio of the drive end to the driven end. the effective length of the driven end doesn't change as it slides across the valve stem but the drive lenght gets shorter as it moves through its arch and gets closer to the center the rocker shaft
  13. Survey on crank damper pullies

    That works John! NB. Bestway is to right click on link and open in new tab, which won't close this thread, as you cant comment in the place the document opens, so saves jumping back through to get to this thread again. Alan
  14. You may recall, I asked people to contribute to this survey earlier this year. I can now publish the results and have done so on the "Technical articles and Reviews Forum" But apparently, that is restricted in some way - it was originally the private publishing site of Dave Sideways himself, and while I can put things there, there are still some restrictions. I posted a Word document there but others couldn't read it, so put the report in as a plain post, asking for comments - and others can't reply there! SO! Please go and have a read at http://sideways-technologies.co.uk/forums/index.php?/topic/7830-survey-on-crank-damper-pullies/&tab=comments#comment-103143 And post your comments here? Thanks! JOhn
  15. The Real Triumph Rocker Ratio

    Comment is always valuable, making someone question a theory or even an interpretation of data is what scientific process is all about, you may regard what I posted as target to be shot at, I certainly do, and given the time I would experiment even more! Alan
  16. The Real Triumph Rocker Ratio

    Thank you, Alan! If I had realised the depth of your expertise in forecasting, I don't think I would have ventured a comment! And as you say, the variation on ratio across the range is a fascinating phenomenenon. Given the action of rocker on valve stem, while the rocker rotates about a fixed shaft, I expected a change but one that varied as a sine wave, as the absolute distance from contact point, either push rod or valve stem, to rocker shaft varies with angle. But yopu have proved otherwise! John
  17. I'm told that despite that link seeming to work fine for me, it is a delusion and it just opens the file from my own PC, and is unreadable by others. So here goes for it as a post. As I feared, it suffers in terms of layout and format, sections in bold or underline that I can't correct, but I think it's readable Please go to to comment. as there are some restrictions here in this special forum - of whihc I was unaware! JOhn Introduction A reciprocating engine is subject to different types of vibration. The crankpin is inherently unbalanced, so web extensions in the opposite direction to the journal can achieve static but not dynamic balance, as the shaft spins and journals in different planes cause a twisting moment about the shaft. The crank will also be subject to primary and secondary vibration due to piston movement. The piston accelerates at each end of its stroke, reacting against the crank, and that motion is faster at the top than at the bottom of the stroke, so that secondary vibration occurs twice as fast as primary. The straight-six engine is the equivalent of two three-cylinder engines with all those forces opposing each other, so that it is uniquely smooth running, but the longer crankshaft allows torsional vibration to become important. As each piston descends in the power stroke, against the load or just the inertia of the rest of the drivetrain, it bends the journal on the main bearings of the crankshaft, which rebound and oscillate in the same way as a struck tuning fork, at the ‘natural’ frequency of the part. A vibrating tuning fork will cause another of the same size to resonate, at the same frequency as the first. If the input frequency into the journal is the same as its natural frequency, then it will resonate, amplifying the vibration. Resonance can shatter a wine glass at its resonant frequency, and there may be several “critical speeds” at which a crankshaft will resonate with the frequency of firing strokes. Torsional vibration dampers absorb the energy of vibration and dissipate it as heat. There are many different designs, which depend on: Viscous friction Solid Friction Fluid viscosity Tuned elastomer mass dampers The last is most commonly used for production car engines, as it can be made cheaply, is relatively light in weight and requires no maintenance. Survey of crank damper pullies A survey was devised and placed on the website Survey Monkey. It was publicised via websites and message boards in the UK and America, and on Facebook pages, all devoted to the Triumph marque. Users were invited to visit the survey and complete it. The purpose of the survey was to find a denominator for the incidence of failed crank damper pulleys in Triumph engines. To promote compliance, it only contained five questions, four factual and a last question on their opinion if the broken crankshaft was due to the faulty damper. The Survey ran from the beginning of January to the end of February 2018. A total of 207 owners responded to the survey. Results Q1. Duration of ownership Q.2. Models owned Q.3.Faulty crank dampers seen Q.4. Known fractured crankshafts Q.5 Opinions on cause of crank failure Q.6. Free Text This unstructured text box allowed responders to write what they liked. 109 responders offered opinions, difficult to categorise, but showing several had owned more than one Triumph for many years, rebuilding up to seven engines, all without any sign that the dampers were faulty. A rebuild involves finding TDC, to time the camshaft and ignition, so a faulty damper would be found if the builder compared that with actual piston position. Several commented that the outer edge of the rubber in the damper showed signs of deterioration, being swollen and cracked (see title page). Some had replaced the damper, either by having it rebuilt, with another, better looking damper or with a non-Triumph damper pulley. One had shaved off the swollen cracked edge, found the rubber beneath in good condition and used it again, with no apparent ill effect. Three commented that they had seen broken crankshafts, one twice, but they were in racing Triumphs. Another had seen one while the car was still under the manufacturer’s warranty. The last had seen one in an earlier Triumph, a TR3A, but that was an earlier, four-cylinder engine with no damper. Others commented on seeing faulty dampers on other cars, including the Volvo B21 red-block engines, Ford F150 V8 and Triumph Stag. Conclusion The owner who had seen a crank broken under guarantee thought that this might have been due to a faulty damper, but this seems unlikely so early in the car’s life. It is more likely to have been faulty manufacture of the crank, not deterioration through age. The survey showed that nearly two thirds of responders had owned one for more than twenty years, so their experience may be expected to be typical. However, they owned a range of those vehicles that is not in line with the known production figures: Model % Produced of Total % Owned in last 20 years Saloon 2L/2.5 66 14 TR5/6 19 51 GT6/Vitesse 15 35 The attraction of a “British sports car” as a preservation project in the TRs and less so in the GT6 and Vitesse models contrasts with how few of the saloons have survived. This, however is not relevant, as all these cars had very similar viscous rubber mass dampers, only varying slightly as the 2.5liter engines had wider pulleys Of those who responded, there were 41 (20%), known crank damper failures, and 32 known crank failures (16%), but only 12% of responders considered the damper failure as the cause of the crank fracture. They were not asked to amplify what other cause might have led to such a major malfunction, but despite the obvious association there are many other potential causes, and a list would have been only confusing. The opinion of experts, while not contradicting the experience of owners, contradicts each other and is not helpful in this matter. The statistics must decide, and that a fifth of the owners of surviving cars had known of a failed damper is a large proportion. The concern of owners on this problem is justified. However, the worried owner has no method of resolving his concern. Inspection of almost any used Triumph damper will show apparent deterioration of the rubber, but four out of five will still function adequately. A method of testing dampers is needed, to reassure owners, or to demonstrate that the expense of a new damper is essential. This project justifies further research to discover such a method.
  18. The Real Triumph Rocker Ratio

    Hi John This I'm not trying to be argumentative (well OK maybe a bit) but cumulative linear graphs are very deceptive, they have an awful habit of predicting the future based on the past, not the conditions ahead. To use a motoring euphemism its like driving watching what has happened in the rear view mirror and using that data to predict where you should be turning ahead. Having spent the 30+ years of my life writing forecasting software for manufacturing and distribution companies its a flaw we find in even very sophisticated software packages, and have spent a great deal of time getting them to behave better. The simple example is, take a product that has had a demand of 100 a month for the last year, a simple forecast would be 12 x100 /12 =100, you need to make 100 next month. So lets add in some change, a 100 a month for 10 months, then 90 then 80, so we calculate 10x100 + 90 + 80 / 12 = 97.5, you need to make 97/98 next month. So as we can already see the forecast for next month is already dubious as we haven't really taken into account what happened in the last two months, (we have a tiny bit, but not enough) Now if those were cheap washers it really doesn't matter if we buy/make 97 instead of ? (and calculating ? is where I have earnt my living) but if they are jet engines the difference between 97 and 70 (as some might forecast) and ? (as I might forecast) could be significant. So the problem is that a cumulative model of cam lift to valve lift has the same problem, it predicts that growth in valve lift is based on a sort of average of historic valve lift to cam lift, it doesn't factor in significantly enough what the recent/current ratio is, likewise just taking the current ratio is also likely to be incorrect, as in the above example you have to be very careful in forecasting the next step, is 97 a good number? 70? or is it likely to be a more complex calculation that works out the percentage drop on average 2 months ago, and then the percentage drop 1 month ago with a bit of clever weighting that applies a bit more import to the recent trend (but not totally) to arrive at ? Which is exactly my argument about valve lift, whilst the cumulative trend is interesting and adds weight to the direction of travel of lift, as does the average linear ratio that has occurred, the most important numbers are what the ratio currently is if you are going to try and predict what the next n of cam lift is going to deliver in valve lift. The fact that the ratio generated by the rocker assembly isn't a static figure, but is moving both up and down, means that you can't use a generic average ratio meaningfully , likewise even though I now know precise ratio figures for my rocker geometry and would have a level of confidence in predicting generally what would happen if I added an extra 0.030 of cam lift as a next step, I can't be a 100% certain as I don't know exactly what ratio the rocker geometry will deliver unless I actually measure it. What I do know is that its far more likely to be in the 1.3:1 range (because that's what the current ratio is) than 1.5:1 which the linear average would predict. Alan
  19. I likewise have not had a good run with AVO's. I love bilsteins, but no adjustment possible. Koni yellows are available in a motorsport damper in roughly the right size - on the books at least.
  20. ebay

    I don't use ebay to sell stuff, in fact, thinking about it, I don't sell stuff very often anyway. However I do use ebay to buy stuff, the option to collect at Argos being particularly useful. For instance, I was able to buy a pair of seats from Demon Tweaks that way without incurring some surcharge for carriage (because the carrier only had to deliver to Argos in Lancashire, Argos then do the rest). Several times I have bought from ebay sellers who don't actually offer delivery to Scotland, using the Argos route. Once I tried to buy a set of wheels and the seller wanted an additional £46 on top of what I had paid because my address was in Scotland even though the wheels were going to Greater `Manchester! Even though I don't have an account with them, UPS would have collected and delivered they wheels for £42 rather than the £65 I was being asked for. Needless to say I went to another seller for the wheels.... Ian.
  21. Do we need a new forum? After Alan's research on rocker ratios, I can offer mine on crank dampers. This project brought together my own interest and my need for one as a subject for the main assignment of second year at Uni. That paper is now complete, but I'll be grateful for the opinions of the Common Room of the Faculty of Sideways, that would let me polish it before submission next week. I've stripped out a lot of extra verbiage, references etc. to leave an explanation of the need for a crank damper, as I fear this isn't common knowledge even among experienced Triumpheros, plus the survey results and my conclusions. I've uploaded it as a Word document, as it's easier to keep the charts in place. Just click on the link and it should download to your PC. So, criticise away, please! John Survey of crank damper pullies - MsB version.docx
  22. EFI issue. K3.

    Presume you have a target AFR table? Where you want max power you want 12.5. And I have used 15.2 at light load cruise areas. And some interpolation. And I have had trouble with idle, and got mine set at 14.2 I suspect the coolant temp calibration is a bit off....or the compensation.
  23. Yesterday
  24. ebay

    I had a recent result when I was given the heads up on a £1 fees day (but plus paypal fees of course) Bit of a result, sold a set of wheels for £250 and a roll bar for £85, so a substantial saving. On top of that the lovely wheel buyer (German) bought an extra wheel, and without asking payed extra for packaging. A delightful buyer, far removed for the horror stories I hear. But I rarely sell on fleabay, but ought to get my arse into gear and list stuff as it is does have a big audience, but high charges. Hopefully another offer will come up....
  25. EFI issue. K3.

    Hi, The AEM has arrived. I will fit on Saturday or Friday night after work. I have received a prompt reply from Dave at Emerald concerning the K3 feedback settings so that I can run in adaptive mode to tune n drive. I am going to set around idle @ 14.7 AFR. Adaptive everywhere else at ??.?. Cheers, Iain.
  26. ebay

    This is why although I do buy on ebay reasonably often, I almost never sell. Mind you, our local auction house makes their charging structure look very reasonable........ Your original selling price seems quite good though? Nick
  27. ebay

    I think it's the unfortunate cost of selling on ebay. I've given up - low value stuff just goes to the tip now, I can't be arsed with the time wasters and paypal/ebay charges. (Unless it's car stuff and I can offer it on sites like this)
  28. ebay

    Yep that's about the cost of it, you can of course "ask" if your buyer will pay you direct (although they may prefer the protection that paypal offers), so you could save the PayPal charges and get a better exchange rate, but the ebay fee's you are stuck with. I usually work on the theory that a lot of times you will get a better price via ebay as a lot more people see it, so I just grin and bear it! Alan
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